Legislature(1993 - 1994)
04/14/1994 03:00 PM House L&C
| Audio | Topic |
|---|
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HB 458 - CHILD SUPPORT NONPAYMENT/LICENSING BAN Number 187 REP. MACKIE moved to adopt CS, 4/14/94 work draft, for HB 458, thereby officially placing it before the committee. Number 194 (Chairman Hudson excused both Rep. Mackie and Rep. Porter from the meeting.) Number 195 CHAIRMAN HUDSON said because of the late date in the session, the committee would honor its commitment to the prime sponsor. He asked Rep. John Davies to explain the difference between the CS and HB 458 that was previously heard. Number 197 REP. JOHN DAVIES, Prime Sponsor of HB 458, presented a list of desirable changes that had been incorporated into the CS. He read these changes to the committee from the document entitled, "Changes to CS HB 458; Work Draft 8-LS1440\E". He referred to the request to include the word "reasonable" and said this was not included because it seemed to be redundant and because of consistency difficulties throughout the document. He also acknowledged that the concern pertaining to "parallel appeal processes" had been addressed. He said if this bill wanted to go to the Finance Committee there could be further discussion about which items should be included on the list given the financial impact. He said, "If you are happy with the way the bill is, if we were to just move it out of the committee so that the CS became the committee substitute, then we could request official fiscal notes to the substitute and that information would then be available to the Finance Committee, if they choose to look at what the fiscal impacts would be for the various licenses on the list." Number 320 MARY GAY, Director, Child Support Enforcement Division (CSED), Department of Revenue, said the changes would enhance the bill and she was pleased that a licensing bill to help with the collection of child support had been brought forth. She said this legislation would serve as a vehicle to induce self-employed people to pay their child support. MS. GAY said last year CSED collected 50 million dollars in child support from 46 percent of the cases with established orders, indicating that child support was not received from 54 percent of the cases. She said a national statistic estimates 46 percent of the population as self-employed. She explained that by estimating 25 percent of self-employed people as not paying child support, an estimated six million dollars could be collected. She further explained that 50 percent of that would be for Aid to Families with Dependent Children (AFDC) cases totaling approximately three million dollars, one and one half million of which would be returned to the general fund. She concluded by saying this would help the state and it would help families. Number 345 REP. MULDER asked if this would assist the division in identifying people who owe money in child support payments. MS. GAY replied that hopefully people would come to CSED because they would want to keep their licenses. REP. MULDER asked if this would diminish CSED's pursuer costs. MS. GAY responded in the affirmative. She mentioned that congress is considering mandating the licensing law nationally so that certain licenses would have to interface with CSED. She commented that Alaskans might have a higher percentage of self-employed people than other places. In response to Rep. Mulder's question about the amount of money in arrears, she said the total amount was 330 million dollars. Ms. Gay considered input from Lorraine Derr and then said she was unsure of the annual arrears amount, but she could check into it. REP. MULDER wondered how big this problem was and if the proposed legislation was an effective means of reaching people. Number 395 MS. GAY said this approach has been helpful in other states such as California, Washington, South Dakota, Minnesota, and Maine. REP. DAVIES interjected and said the following states "go after licenses": Arizona, California, Maine, Minnesota, Pennsylvania, South Dakota, and Vermont. MS. GAY said she had access to more complete information in this regard. Number 410 REP. MULDER pointed out that taking away a person's commercial fishing license or limited entry permit might, in effect, deny that person the opportunity to catch up in their child support payments. MS. GAY said they put liens on permits but do not enforce the sale of permits. REP. MULDER confirmed with Ms. Gay that CSED would be the first in line and would have to be satisfied before the permit could be transferred. He considered this to be a reasonable means. Number 429 REP. DAVIES said the intent of the bill is not to take away licenses, but to get people's attention in order to begin a serious dialogue regarding the level of payment capable of being made. He said experience from other states indicates that 80 percent of the cases come into compliance upon notification. He said the other 20 percent would be worked with to determine possible arrangements. He added he did not think it was CSED's intent to be collecting licenses, although he indicated there might be cases where the ability to pay is demonstrated and yet the person shows contempt for the process. He said in those cases the ability to earn a livelihood is clearly demonstrated and there is no question of taking livelihood away from a person. Number 447 REP. MULDER said this was an important point to have on record. He asked if this legislation could be viewed as helping to establish the connection between payer and payee, thereby resorting to seizure of the license or permit as a means of last resort. MS. GAY answered this was correct. She mentioned that keeping the focus on occupational licenses is most appropriate because what CSED really wants is compliance. REP. MULDER recommended that if the costs of performing computer match-ups proved to be substantive, those costs be charged to the person in arrears so that the state would not bear additional costs. MS. GAY explained that approximately 100 percent of CSED's budget is provided by the federal government and is determined from a combination of federal incentives based on collection, and a 66 percent match. She said the state would not be responsible for the data processing expenses incurred because those expenses could be submitted to the federal government. She added that CSED could feasibly collect three million dollars from AFDC cases and 50 percent of the portion collected would go to the general fund. Number 496 REP. DAVIES added that in a net sense, there would be minimal implementation costs involved in collecting even one million dollars. He also mentioned that in the CS, page 6, line 8, section (o), there is already a provision pertaining to Rep. Mulder's suggestion. Number 500 REP. GREEN referred to the sum of approximately one-half million dollars in fiscal notes and asked if there were statistics from other states indicating their success rates with implementing this type of program. He explained the basis of his inquiry was he wondered about the probable stability of some of the people in arrears and asked if the CSED would have to go back and forth on a given case because people would have a series of excuses, specifically if a lien was put on a license. Number 506 MS. GAY replied that she thought a portion of the people notified would respond and pay, and a portion would ignore their responsibility. She reiterated that noncompliance provided for a 2,500 dollar minimum and explained that liens were put on fishermen's licenses and not on something like a hairdresser's license. She said CSED would not pro-actively be taking licenses away. She explained that a person would have the choice to have a payment plan and to continue their license. She pointed out to Rep. Green that even if a large sum of money were owed, a person could still be in agreement with CSED by paying something toward the arrears. She said this situation is more difficult in court-ordered child support cases. TAPE 94-38, SIDE B Number 019 MATT ANDERSON, Training Coordinator, Emergency Medical Services, Division of Public Health, Department of Health and Social Services, referred to CS page 2, line 9, paragraph (d). He mentioned that his office commonly issues certificates that are 60 days in length and he inquired as to the appropriate method of managing this situation. He suggested the language be changed to read, "up to 150 days". REP. DAVIES said possibly the way to handle this situation was to exempt temporary licenses from the list. Number 039 MR. ANDERSON agreed this would address that particular problem. He then referred to page 8, line 18, and asked if this query was clearly from CSED and not from any other agency. Upon hearing from Rep. Davies's staff that, yes, the query was from CSED, he suggested that the language read, "when queried by an agency under (a) of this section as to the license status..." He said the division is supportive of HB 458 and wants to make sure they can implement it properly. Number 072 PATRICIA J. O'BRIEN, Social Services Program Officer, Division of Family and Youth Services (DFYS), Department of Health and Social Services, said DFYS supports the intent of HB 458 but has concerns pertaining to children's programs. She noted that DFYS is short-staffed and currently recognizes HB 412's "community care facilities" as an attempt to help streamline their licensing process and views this legislation as complicating that process. She also mentioned that if the assisted living bill passes, it might affect adult foster homes and adult residential care facilities. She said DFYS's largest concern with regard to HB 458 is foster homes. She mentioned the 90-day emergency licensing at foster homes and several other reasons as evidence that child foster care facilities should be removed from this list. She mentioned other facilities, such as family child care homes and child care centers, as facilities that might be negatively affected by HB 458. She said with regard to family child care homes, Alaska has one of the most liberal statutes in the nation in that a person can care for four children without a license. She explained that DFYS encourages people to become licensed and because this legislation might dissuade that from happening, the division would prefer that this not apply to family child care homes. She explained that DFYS is concerned about potential litigation and safety for children, and as they do not allow child care centers to operate without a license, they would prefer that child care centers also not be included on this list. Number 137 CHAIRMAN HUDSON said the committee would hold HB 458 and suggested that Rep. Davies contact the Finance Committee. He said he did not want to move the bill on to the Judiciary Committee until they had responded to the concerns expressed in today's meeting. He said Rep. Davies could submit another draft and the committee would be happy to bring the bill back up again. Number 157 REP. DAVIES replied that concerns mentioned today seemed to be straightforward and relatively easy to address. He thought the issue regarding which licenses to include on the list should be approached from a financial context pertaining to a cost benefit analysis of the impact on the agencies. He added that this would be difficult to accomplish until he had a current fiscal note. REP. MULDER said he was particularly sensitive to the concerns expressed by Ms. O'Brien. He said helping one child at the expense of others is not good policy, even if there were economic benefits involved. He said he was interested in the cost benefit but suspected the overall benefit would be toward excluding some categories from the list. Number 179 CHAIRMAN HUDSON said this was a policy call that could be based on costs and other things, but he appreciated the input from Ms. O'Brien. Number 182 REP. DAVIES agreed that testimony from Ms. O'Brien was well received and indicated that he did not see a problem with excluding certain facilities from the list. Number 183 CHAIRMAN HUDSON adjourned the meeting at 4:20 p.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|